MoinMoin: MoinMoinChat/Logs/moin-dev/2006-01-06

2006-01-06T00:05:57  <xorAxAx> [PERIODIC ANNOUNCEMENT] Logs can be found on http://moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de/MoinMoinChat/Logs/moin-dev
2006-01-06T07:59:16  <lydon> moin
2006-01-06T09:17:24  <ThomasWaldmann> moin
2006-01-06T09:31:33  <dschaedl> good morning - moin
2006-01-06T09:31:34  <dschaedl> I'm just upgrading from 1.3.4 to 1.5. As I changed the login mechanism in 1.3 I also need to migrate this to 1.5.
2006-01-06T09:31:34  <dschaedl> In 1.3 I simply set self.auth_username to the username I wanted to. In 1.5 I can not find self.auth_username anymore. Where has it gone to?
2006-01-06T09:32:44  <dschaedl> self.auth_username@request.py
2006-01-06T09:38:47  <ThomasWaldmann> for what do you use it exactly?
2006-01-06T09:43:11  <dschaedl> I want to ommit the login into moinmoin using the moinmoin-loginpage. As we use it on the intranet and are already authenticated, apache is already aware of the username and passes it as a http-header field to moinmoin. The user is extracted in moinmodpy and then used in request again to set the user for moinmoin.
2006-01-06T09:43:39  <dschaedl> this is working fine currently in 1.3
2006-01-06T09:45:52  <ThomasWaldmann> so you use http auth?
2006-01-06T09:46:04  <ThomasWaldmann> basic auth?
2006-01-06T09:46:28  <dschaedl> finally, yes
2006-01-06T09:58:15  <ThomasWaldmann> so look at auth = [MoinMoin.auth.http]
2006-01-06T10:07:39  <xorAxAx> dschaedl: you are unfortunately wrong here, please use #moin, thanks
2006-01-06T10:08:43  <dschaedl> ok, thanks anyway
2006-01-06T11:52:24  <xorAxAx> hi mitsuhiko
2006-01-06T11:52:29  <mitsuhiko> hi xorAxAx
2006-01-06T11:52:43  <mitsuhiko> so 2.0 is 1.3 with some patches :-/
2006-01-06T11:52:48  <xorAxAx> yeah
2006-01-06T11:53:07  <xorAxAx> there is no plan on the wiki yet which describes how the transition should be done
2006-01-06T11:53:59  <xorAxAx> and 1.5 needs a lot of care, we have nearly 100 bugs, including some big ones
2006-01-06T11:54:03  <mitsuhiko> why not apply the 2.0 patches to the final 1.5 version?
2006-01-06T11:54:51  <xorAxAx> sounds sensible but the re-branch should be done after there are some plans on the wiki
2006-01-06T11:55:07  <xorAxAx> esp. regarding goals. 2.0 had all goals you could think of
2006-01-06T11:55:13  <xorAxAx> because of that, it failed
2006-01-06T11:56:31  <mitsuhiko> i can wait :)
2006-01-06T11:56:39  <xorAxAx> my new feature goal is a session system and integration of it into xmlrpc
2006-01-06T11:57:00  <mitsuhiko> my feature goal is template support in moin :)
2006-01-06T11:57:02  <xorAxAx> after that, i can write a short auth module and integrate the session system into moin
2006-01-06T11:57:24  <xorAxAx> of course i wont reinvent the wheel
2006-01-06T11:58:08  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: 2.0 branch should inclue a new wiki syntax
2006-01-06T11:58:14  <mitsuhiko> sounds strange
2006-01-06T11:58:15  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: have you thought about building a session system that doesnt depend on 2.0 but simply runs as a plugin?
2006-01-06T11:58:24  <xorAxAx> what sounds strange?
2006-01-06T11:58:29  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: new syntax
2006-01-06T11:58:34  <xorAxAx> s/session/template/
2006-01-06T11:58:49  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: better syntax :)
2006-01-06T11:58:51  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: it would be possible
2006-01-06T11:59:10  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: of course, you can simply write a theme base system that uses templates
2006-01-06T11:59:11  <mitsuhiko> but with a template engine plugins could use it
2006-01-06T11:59:19  <mitsuhiko> for example the [[UserPreferences]] macro
2006-01-06T11:59:22  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: you can ship it as an add-on
2006-01-06T11:59:44  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: ah, yeah, there are such hard-coded structures
2006-01-06T11:59:52  <mitsuhiko> and those suck :)
2006-01-06T12:00:05  <mitsuhiko> my idea:
2006-01-06T12:00:15  <mitsuhiko> moin has a "default" template
2006-01-06T12:00:27  <mitsuhiko> each plugin registeres a nice template part there
2006-01-06T12:00:51  <mitsuhiko> (each plugin could also provide a template inside the plugin.py file)
2006-01-06T12:01:14  <mitsuhiko> a template designer can load these structures using {% extends moindefault.userpreferces %}
2006-01-06T12:01:17  <mitsuhiko> for example
2006-01-06T12:01:34  <xorAxAx> umm, a template mainly consists of html
2006-01-06T12:01:38  <mitsuhiko> then it would be possible to redesign each part of the wiki with few code
2006-01-06T12:01:40  <xorAxAx> how can you extend html?
2006-01-06T12:01:52  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: mom. i create an example
2006-01-06T12:02:46  <mitsuhiko> http://paste.ubuntuusers.de/1251
2006-01-06T12:03:05  <mitsuhiko> the block "content" can get overwritten by a subtemplate
2006-01-06T12:03:38  <mitsuhiko> like this: http://paste.ubuntuusers.de/1252
2006-01-06T12:03:54  <mitsuhiko> and this would also define a new plugin point "footer"
2006-01-06T12:03:56  <xorAxAx> yeah, i know that
2006-01-06T12:04:08  <xorAxAx> but lets stick to the userpref example
2006-01-06T12:04:23  <xorAxAx> btw, i dislike the marker keyword :)
2006-01-06T12:04:39  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: you can also use {% block content %}{% endblock %} ^^
2006-01-06T12:04:48  <mitsuhiko> instead of marker
2006-01-06T12:05:20  <mitsuhiko> i'll create an example UserPreferences Plugin. mom
2006-01-06T12:05:23  <mitsuhiko> s/Plugin/Template
2006-01-06T12:05:48  <xorAxAx> i have never understood why we force people to learn python
2006-01-06T12:10:04  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: http://paste.ubuntuusers.de/1253
2006-01-06T12:10:27  <mitsuhiko> [[UserPreferences]] looks for the user template
2006-01-06T12:10:48  <mitsuhiko> if it doesn't find one it loads that from moinmoin.actions.userpreferences or something similar
2006-01-06T12:11:48  <mitsuhiko> the template designer can request a list of all context elements by adding {% debug %} to the template. so there is no need for looking into the moin sources
2006-01-06T12:16:29  <xorAxAx> so, how would he extend it?
2006-01-06T12:16:42  <mitsuhiko> he wouldn't extend it
2006-01-06T12:16:55  <mitsuhiko> he would copy the templatepart to his template folder
2006-01-06T12:16:58  <mitsuhiko> modifiy it
2006-01-06T12:17:00  <xorAxAx> 12:01:14 < mitsuhiko> a template designer can load these structures using {% extends moindefault.userpreferces %}
2006-01-06T12:17:04  <xorAxAx> :-)
2006-01-06T12:17:21  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: but not extend them :O)
2006-01-06T12:17:45  <mitsuhiko> user creates an template movefile
2006-01-06T12:17:50  <mitsuhiko> s/movefile/movepage/
2006-01-06T12:18:06  <mitsuhiko> when he doesn't want to override the overall design
2006-01-06T12:18:12  <mitsuhiko> he can do:
2006-01-06T12:18:17  <mitsuhiko> {% extends moinmoin.base %}
2006-01-06T12:18:21  <mitsuhiko> {% block content %}
2006-01-06T12:18:24  <mitsuhiko>   sadgasgdasg
2006-01-06T12:18:28  <mitsuhiko> {% endblock %}
2006-01-06T12:18:43  <mitsuhiko> then he extends the templatepart "moinmoin/base.html"
2006-01-06T12:20:10  <xorAxAx> would such a system be enough for the theme system only at first?
2006-01-06T12:20:34  <xorAxAx> if the users and theme writers agree, we can bundle it tighter with the code in the next step
2006-01-06T12:20:50  <xorAxAx> but at first, one could distribute it and see if the template designers like it
2006-01-06T12:22:00  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: in any case the would like it more then the current solution :)
2006-01-06T12:22:20  <xorAxAx> yeah
2006-01-06T12:22:30  <xorAxAx> esp. the hardcoded texts suck
2006-01-06T12:23:40  <xorAxAx> so, how do you think about creating such a theme system?
2006-01-06T12:24:09  <xorAxAx> we could even put it into the main stable branch because it would not need to modify core code
2006-01-06T12:28:51  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: so? :-)
2006-01-06T12:29:59  <mitsuhiko> i'm thinking about it :)
2006-01-06T12:30:28  <mitsuhiko> currently themes inherit "ThemeBase"
2006-01-06T12:30:39  <mitsuhiko> maybe a template could look like this
2006-01-06T12:30:41  <mitsuhiko> momentones
2006-01-06T12:32:21  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: http://paste.ubuntuusers.de/1254
2006-01-06T12:33:00  <mitsuhiko> where template.name is the foldername where jinja finds the templates
2006-01-06T12:33:39  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: and moin has to provide a jinja template filter "i18n"
2006-01-06T12:33:53  <mitsuhiko> otherwise it wouldn't be possible to use gettext inside templates
2006-01-06T12:33:53  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: yeah, feel free to implement it :)
2006-01-06T12:33:58  <mitsuhiko> i will do
2006-01-06T12:34:08  <mitsuhiko> but after the 1.5 release
2006-01-06T12:34:25  <xorAxAx> then create a short sample template and i will try to merge it
2006-01-06T12:34:36  <xorAxAx> why just after the release?
2006-01-06T12:34:42  <xorAxAx> do you expect stable apis? muhahahah
2006-01-06T12:35:14  <xorAxAx> :-)
2006-01-06T12:36:33  <mitsuhiko> LOL
2006-01-06T12:36:49  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: i will think about it :)
2006-01-06T12:37:31  <xorAxAx> some people even succeed in breaking apis and not fixing the core codebase afterwards :-/
2006-01-06T12:37:45  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: and some unit tests would be nice as well :)
2006-01-06T12:54:51  <mitsuhiko> xorAxAx: won't work :(
2006-01-06T12:55:00  <mitsuhiko> i have to edit much core code
2006-01-06T12:55:04  <xorAxAx> what wont work?
2006-01-06T12:55:05  <xorAxAx> why?
2006-01-06T12:55:27  <mitsuhiko> the edit action
2006-01-06T12:56:04  <mitsuhiko> i can handle this in the template wrapper but this would be stupid because other actions can't require a template part
2006-01-06T12:56:21  <xorAxAx> what do you mean by that?
2006-01-06T12:59:00  <mitsuhiko> a template would consist only of 3 parts: overall.html, edit.html and showpage.html
2006-01-06T12:59:08  <mitsuhiko> not many parts for a template design
2006-01-06T12:59:10  <mitsuhiko> +er
2006-01-06T12:59:53  <xorAxAx> hmm, its more thatn that
2006-01-06T13:00:36  <xorAxAx> its RC
2006-01-06T13:00:41  <xorAxAx> additionally
2006-01-06T13:00:52  <xorAxAx> but those parts should be enough for the first stage
2006-01-06T13:04:12  <xorAxAx> mitsuhiko: so?
2006-01-06T13:04:36  <mitsuhiko> after 1.5 release ^^
2006-01-06T13:05:02  <xorAxAx> ok
2006-01-06T13:41:02  <xorAxAx> starshine_away: so, INSTALL.html is incomplete?
2006-01-06T16:02:45  <starshine> xorAxAx: yes. local tag #fastcgi-install leads to space above mod_py using apache
2006-01-06T16:03:01  <starshine> but there is no content there about fastcgi
2006-01-06T16:04:44  <starshine> the website proper does have info about fastcgi, so I think the wrong page is being asked for in whatever script composes the INSTALL.html for the tarball
2006-01-06T17:24:59  <ThomasWaldmann> moin
2006-01-06T18:10:18  <xorAxAx> ThomasWaldmann: can you look into that INSTALL.html issue?