MoinMoin: MoinMoinChat/Logs/moin-dev/2006-01-09

2006-01-09T00:05:27  <xorAxAx> [PERIODIC ANNOUNCEMENT] Logs can be found on http://moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de/MoinMoinChat/Logs/moin-dev
2006-01-09T07:28:27  <lydon> moin
2006-01-09T08:17:21  <ThomasWaldmann> moin
2006-01-09T08:31:15  <ThomasWaldmann> lydon: if you have some time, can you review the twikidraw stuff?
2006-01-09T08:34:33  <ThomasWaldmann> (the one in the repo, esp. the new build.xml as well as the rest of patches in the wiki)
2006-01-09T08:54:30  <lydon> hmmm
2006-01-09T08:56:47  <lydon> moin--main--1.5?
2006-01-09T09:00:13  <lydon> moin fabi
2006-01-09T09:00:25  <Fabi> moin
2006-01-09T09:02:08  <ThomasWaldmann> lydon: ja
2006-01-09T09:02:27  <ThomasWaldmann> moin Fabi
2006-01-09T09:03:21  <lydon> ThomasWaldmann: builds
2006-01-09T09:03:30  <lydon> I check if it runs, too
2006-01-09T09:03:39  <lydon> shell script or makefile?
2006-01-09T09:04:02  <lydon> the build.xml essentially is a makefile... just for ant not for make
2006-01-09T09:06:25  <ThomasWaldmann> if "just run ant" is enough to describe it, we dont need a Makefile
2006-01-09T09:06:52  <ThomasWaldmann> having a 2 line Makefile wouldnt harm otoh
2006-01-09T09:07:11  <lydon> essentially you type 'ant' and it builds the applet
2006-01-09T09:07:20  <lydon> this is put inside the builde directory
2006-01-09T09:07:25  <lydon> build
2006-01-09T09:08:06  <lydon> so we should add a 'and move build/twikidraw.jar to your applet directory'
2006-01-09T09:08:13  <lydon> to the readme
2006-01-09T09:08:21  <ThomasWaldmann> yes
2006-01-09T09:08:37  <ThomasWaldmann> or do a "make install" target
2006-01-09T09:08:46  <lydon> normally noone should need to rebuild this, and the ones needing to should know what they do :)
2006-01-09T09:09:16  <ThomasWaldmann> we shouldnt require java knowledge from a debian maintainer
2006-01-09T09:09:49  <lydon> I guess so...
2006-01-09T09:09:59  <ThomasWaldmann> it is hard enough having him install nonfree software X)
2006-01-09T09:10:22  <lydon> hehe
2006-01-09T09:10:55  <ThomasWaldmann> there are some additional patches on your page
2006-01-09T09:11:14  <ThomasWaldmann> i was unsure whether they should be applied or not
2006-01-09T09:11:21  <lydon> ach, wen seh ich denn hier :)
2006-01-09T09:12:23  <ThomasWaldmann> but it would be nice to have that page cleaned up somehow and maybe some bugs relating to twd resolved
2006-01-09T09:12:55  <lydon> what page? mine or a different one?
2006-01-09T09:13:54  <ThomasWaldmann> your twd page
2006-01-09T09:14:13  <ThomasWaldmann> bugs on some different ones
2006-01-09T09:14:48  <lydon> MoinMoin:MoinMoinBugs/CannotUpdateCreateDrawings
2006-01-09T09:15:23  <lydon> the diff seems to be the recommended way of deploying in a mixed browser environ... the link to the sun page.
2006-01-09T09:17:19  <lydon> the other way would be to detect the browser by javascript and write the correct tag.
2006-01-09T09:18:41  * ThomasWaldmann has no idea about that. but browser detection code sounds evil.
2006-01-09T09:18:57  <lydon> I know only the thing with the js
2006-01-09T09:19:03  <lydon> its common practice
2006-01-09T09:19:18  <lydon> cause if someone has java enabled, he has javascript, too
2006-01-09T09:19:24  <lydon> so its nothing evil to do it that way.
2006-01-09T09:19:49  <lydon> the HTML thing with object comment and embed sounds evil, cause it depends on the way the browser interprets tags
2006-01-09T09:20:08  <lydon> and if MS decides that comment and embed tags are fine, too, it will break.
2006-01-09T09:20:14  <ThomasWaldmann> maybe some of our other stuff already does that, see common/js/...
2006-01-09T09:20:20  <lydon> yep
2006-01-09T09:20:22  <lydon> I'll check
2006-01-09T09:21:17  <ThomasWaldmann> and maybe remove all code from the wiki that has been committed to the repo
2006-01-09T09:25:48  <lydon> yup
2006-01-09T10:19:23  <xorAxAx> umm, java != js as we all know
2006-01-09T10:19:36  <xorAxAx> so <script></><noscript>...</> is wiser here
2006-01-09T10:30:30  <lydon> not really...
2006-01-09T10:30:40  <lydon> cause java is != js
2006-01-09T11:23:02  <xorAxAx> lydon: ?
2006-01-09T11:23:17  <xorAxAx> 09:19:18 < lydon> cause if someone has java enabled, he has javascript, too
2006-01-09T11:23:58  <xorAxAx> and that is wrong ...
2006-01-09T11:31:29  <ThomasWaldmann> no. it needs not be correct, but usually is.
2006-01-09T11:34:44  <ThomasWaldmann> bbl
2006-01-09T12:01:55  <lydon> xorAxAx: ?
2006-01-09T12:01:58  <lydon> <xorAxAx> so <script></><noscript>...</> is wiser here
2006-01-09T12:02:13  <lydon> where can a script/noscript help if the topic is java?
2006-01-09T12:02:35  <lydon> don't read single lines and spit out knowledge, better try to follow the discussion
2006-01-09T12:07:27  <lydon> but the best solution is perhaps the combined one.
2006-01-09T12:08:03  <lydon> emit a default block using the object/comment/embed hack and add some javascript which (if js is enabled) replaces that fallback block with the correct one for the used browser.
2006-01-09T12:08:09  <lydon> yes, I think I like that one
2006-01-09T12:14:29  <lydon> hmm.. or not... could result in race conditions... need to check
2006-01-09T13:33:01  <xorAxAx> lydon: ok, that should work as well
2006-01-09T13:33:17  <xorAxAx> in fact, that pattern is prevalent in the whole code :)
2006-01-09T13:33:19  <xorAxAx> (JS code)
2006-01-09T13:45:16  <xorAxAx> which 1.5 features should i point out in the release announcement?
2006-01-09T13:46:42  <xorAxAx> Fabi: there is a new bugreport that should be closed easily with "open and close are internal methods", right?
2006-01-09T13:50:26  <lydon> xorAxAx: or just add blockquote to _blocks?
2006-01-09T13:52:14  <lydon> they are internal methods, perhaps, but they are not marked as such. So a macro developer could guess its something he can use... thats a problem in itself, cause open and close are not basic formatter methods but html specific...
2006-01-09T13:52:40  <lydon> hmmm... where is the formatter API definition? ;)
2006-01-09T13:52:48  * Fabi -> lunch
2006-01-09T13:52:51  <Fabi> bb soon
2006-01-09T13:53:04  <lydon> ( to point out the basic problem )
2006-01-09T13:53:08  <xorAxAx> lydon: in the base formatter
2006-01-09T14:01:33  <lydon> so thats the right answer (plus adding blockquote to _blocks)
2006-01-09T14:07:14  <xorAxAx> yeah
2006-01-09T17:11:59  <Fabi> anyone already fixed that bug?
2006-01-09T17:35:01  <ThomasWaldmann> what bug?
2006-01-09T17:55:03  <xorAxAx> Fabi: wrong channel :)
2006-01-09T17:55:09  <xorAxAx> Fabi: no, right one
2006-01-09T17:55:19  <xorAxAx> Fabi: you mean adding blockquote to the list?
2006-01-09T18:40:33  <Fabi> yep
2006-01-09T18:42:14  * ThomasWaldmann didnt fix it
2006-01-09T18:42:28  <ThomasWaldmann> but I have another one if you're working in the formatter :)
2006-01-09T18:43:13  <ThomasWaldmann> that <p> converter crash when saving a page from the gui editor is because of invalid list html generated by the formatter
2006-01-09T18:44:00  <ThomasWaldmann> it generates ul li /li p /p /ul (or similar)
2006-01-09T19:30:01  <xorAxAx> hmm, we should deactivate the form macro
2006-01-09T19:30:45  <xorAxAx> [[Form()]] should render as "Congratulations, you seem to have found ancient documentation. Ignore the existence of this macro :-)"
2006-01-09T19:39:43  <ThomasWaldmann> hehe
2006-01-09T20:21:17  <Fabi> may be forms will raise again soon
2006-01-09T20:21:34  <Fabi> but may be not as a macro
2006-01-09T20:21:38  <Fabi> but as an API
2006-01-09T20:24:26  <xorAxAx> Fabi: half-baken :)
2006-01-09T20:24:30  <xorAxAx> ...? :)
2006-01-09T20:25:27  <Fabi> will integrate an db for planning rpg conventions into moin the next months
2006-01-09T20:25:58  <Fabi> so I already started with some different classes for form handling
2006-01-09T20:26:01  * ThomasWaldmann would rather prefer finishing old stuff first before beginning new stuff
2006-01-09T20:26:40  <Fabi> there are some "we need now" projects
2006-01-09T20:27:34  <Fabi> first one is propoer gallery parser
2006-01-09T20:33:06  <ThomasWaldmann> or finally moving development to 2.0....
2006-01-09T20:33:54  <ThomasWaldmann> or a better working gui editor
2006-01-09T20:34:59  <ThomasWaldmann> and this open/close maybe should be _open/_close
2006-01-09T20:35:25  <Fabi> yep, I already stated so on this bug page