MoinMoin: MoinMoinChat/Logs/moin-dev/2009-06-02

2009-06-02T00:01:19  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: i made a class that takes config as attribute to ease testing
2009-06-02T00:02:04  <ronny> would be more usefull if it was a base for removing the magical getconfig thing
2009-06-02T00:04:24  <ThomasWaldmann> where's the code?
2009-06-02T00:05:15  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: found it...
2009-06-02T00:05:27  <dennda> need your help to find a proper solution
2009-06-02T00:06:52  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/120467/
2009-06-02T00:07:16  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: note that in line 7, unicode strings are passed
2009-06-02T00:07:43  <dennda> which makes _write_stream barf at line 86 and reraise a previous NoSuchRevisionError
2009-06-02T00:08:23  <dennda> that's the first thing that's broken here
2009-06-02T00:08:27  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: mom,
2009-06-02T00:09:15  <dennda> the second is that in line 21 _save is called without mimetype, which makes line 64 unhappy since None (default value) is not acceptable as metadata value
2009-06-02T00:10:07  <dennda> i'm not sure whether u"" is ok there at all...
2009-06-02T00:10:27  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: MoinMoin.wsgiapp.Application
2009-06-02T00:10:44  <ronny> line 233+
2009-06-02T00:10:49  <ronny> (in 1.9)
2009-06-02T00:10:57  <ronny> + branch
2009-06-02T00:11:31  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: yes, the lowlevel stuff shouldn't get unicode content data
2009-06-02T00:11:55  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: so the testcase itself is b0rked?
2009-06-02T00:12:51  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: and why is that just a raise without anything else there? that made debugging it much harder
2009-06-02T00:13:54  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: if it can't get the mimetype from prev rev, it should pass a mimetype
2009-06-02T00:15:37  <dennda> well, then obviously the testcase is just broken itself
2009-06-02T00:16:47  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: well, it logs an error in the line before
2009-06-02T00:16:53  <dennda> yeah
2009-06-02T00:16:57  <dennda> and who reads that anyway? :)
2009-06-02T00:17:20  <ThomasWaldmann> it could raise FooBarException(sametext) :)
2009-06-02T00:17:34  <dennda> I'd appreciate that
2009-06-02T00:17:43  <dennda> (seriously)
2009-06-02T00:19:12  <ThomasWaldmann> ronny: maybe the main problem is that I don't remember what it was about, that it has no comments
2009-06-02T00:20:00  <ThomasWaldmann> maybe you should just show a changeset that applies that code in the way you intended it
2009-06-02T00:20:30  <dennda> aactually, create_page is broken, don't you think?
2009-06-02T00:22:12  <ThomasWaldmann> you could add a .encode('utf-8') and a mimetype=...
2009-06-02T00:23:00  * dennda isn't into encoding/mimetype stuff
2009-06-02T00:23:18  <dennda> what ...? I guess "foo" doesn't count
2009-06-02T00:24:52  <CIA-19> Christopher Denter <moin GUESSWHAT the DASH space DASH station ROUNDTHING com> default * 5874:7526b6ee9948 2.0-storage/MoinMoin/items/__init__.py: storage: Raise proper StorageError when trying to save some unsupported content object. Makes debugging easier
2009-06-02T00:25:10  <ThomasWaldmann> text/moin-wiki
2009-06-02T00:25:14  <dennda> ok
2009-06-02T00:25:19  <dennda> lemme try
2009-06-02T00:25:27  <ThomasWaldmann> (we'll have to straighten all that later)
2009-06-02T00:25:56  <ThomasWaldmann> TheSheep: btw, did you officially apply for a mimetype?
2009-06-02T00:26:20  <dennda> sweet
2009-06-02T00:26:48  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/120470/
2009-06-02T00:27:01  <dennda> with
2009-06-02T00:27:02  <dennda> -    item._save({}, content)
2009-06-02T00:27:04  <dennda> +    item._save({}, content.encode('utf-8'), mimetype="text/moin-wiki")
2009-06-02T00:27:52  <ThomasWaldmann> one could even have a mimetype arg for create_page, with that as default
2009-06-02T00:27:58  *** grzywacz has quit IRC
2009-06-02T00:28:18  <ThomasWaldmann> and maybe only encode if it is unicode
2009-06-02T00:29:38  <ThomasWaldmann> and call it create_item :)
2009-06-02T00:30:21  <ThomasWaldmann> waldi: did you succeed with your merge?
2009-06-02T00:30:52  <dennda> was that supposed to be a hint on how to fix this?
2009-06-02T00:31:22  <ThomasWaldmann> no, that was a saner-implementation hint
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2009-06-02T00:32:35  <dennda> so what I do now is...?
2009-06-02T00:32:41  * dennda looks at his clock
2009-06-02T00:35:00  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: currently its only used in conftest.py for the class collector setup
2009-06-02T00:35:45  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: btw, that code in conftest should be killed in favor of the funcarg hooks as soon as py.test 1.0 is out
2009-06-02T00:40:34  <ThomasWaldmann> ronny: so how should it be used and why is it better than having that Config class defintion within the test?
2009-06-02T00:41:25  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: funcargs is jsut to get rid of those custom collectors
2009-06-02T00:41:46  <ronny> funcargs is a hook system that empowers one to pass arguments to tests
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2009-06-02T00:44:45  <ThomasWaldmann> ronny: i rather meant your stuff than some future py.test stuff
2009-06-02T00:45:13  <ThomasWaldmann> hi amartani
2009-06-02T00:51:36  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: ah, the config glass still is defined within the test, but it has to get to the client/request/whatever somehow
2009-06-02T00:51:42  <ronny> (and also be instanciated)
2009-06-02T00:55:36  <CIA-19> Christopher Denter <moin GUESSWHAT the DASH space DASH station ROUNDTHING com> default * 5875:d2247705a982 2.0-storage/MoinMoin/items/__init__.py: storage: remove comment
2009-06-02T00:57:55  <ThomasWaldmann> ronny: yes, and "how?"
2009-06-02T00:58:36  <ThomasWaldmann> ronny: maybe it would be beneficial if you would just add some more comments, esp. for everybody not reading this conversation
2009-06-02T01:01:51  <amartani> hi ThomasWaldmann
2009-06-02T01:03:10  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: http://hg.moinmo.in/moin/2.0-storage/rev/ab2fcbee88f4 what are you doing with self.request? isn't that default behaviour?
2009-06-02T01:04:48  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: seen google wave demo? :)
2009-06-02T01:05:11  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: nope
2009-06-02T01:05:40  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: but?
2009-06-02T01:05:41  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: that method is called once before every testcase
2009-06-02T01:05:53  <TheSheep> ThomasWaldmann: no, I didn't apply yet
2009-06-02T01:06:07  <TheSheep> ThomasWaldmann: got distracted with other things
2009-06-02T01:06:09  <dennda> hence it effectively creates a new and fresh backend
2009-06-02T01:06:10  <amartani> Not yet..
2009-06-02T01:06:26  <TheSheep> ThomasWaldmann: good thing you reminded me
2009-06-02T01:07:36  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: some more comments in the code then, please
2009-06-02T01:08:47  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: http://wave.google.com/
2009-06-02T01:10:59  <ThomasWaldmann> it shows how collab editing can look like :)
2009-06-02T01:11:29  <amartani> ThomasWaldmann: I heard about it, but didn't had time to watch yet..
2009-06-02T01:12:23  *** grzywacz has quit IRC
2009-06-02T01:13:40  <CIA-19> Christopher Denter <moin GUESSWHAT the DASH space DASH station ROUNDTHING com> default * 5876:550426799c14 2.0-storage/MoinMoin/storage/_tests/test_middleware_acl.py: storage: Add explanatory comment
2009-06-02T01:14:49  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: hm, i'll try
2009-06-02T01:25:22  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: what's your plan for this week? I don't see you communicating much...
2009-06-02T01:31:15  <amartani> ThomasWaldmann: I'm planning to work on controlling users, esp. on displaying who is editing the item. Also, I'm waiting for the answer from mobwrite devs about making mobwrite run without an additional daemon..
2009-06-02T01:32:15  <amartani> ThomasWaldmann: 2.0 doesn't have ACLs yet?
2009-06-02T01:34:31  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: dennda is working on them
2009-06-02T01:35:31  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: it is a bit a pity that this communication didn't happen earlier
2009-06-02T01:35:40  <ThomasWaldmann> I/O takes time
2009-06-02T01:36:07  <ThomasWaldmann> but I hope you can schedule some other project work while waiting for input
2009-06-02T01:38:21  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: btw, you need to catch up a bit, see your diary...
2009-06-02T01:38:30  <amartani> ThomasWaldmann: I'm now working on some tests for these things..
2009-06-02T01:39:45  <amartani> ThomasWaldmann: Yes, I know, sorry, college is being harder than I expected this semester..
2009-06-02T01:44:23  <dennda> n8
2009-06-02T01:44:31  <ThomasWaldmann> gn dennda
2009-06-02T01:46:18  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: your wiki page is a bit lacking, so please update/cleanup page and update diary daily
2009-06-02T01:46:45  <ThomasWaldmann> esp. a plan for this week would be good
2009-06-02T01:46:59  <ThomasWaldmann> and a more detailled plan in general
2009-06-02T01:47:33  <ThomasWaldmann> also, you maybe should talk more to your mentor
2009-06-02T01:48:20  <ThomasWaldmann> he can help you, but not if you are away or not communicating
2009-06-02T01:50:03  <ThomasWaldmann> amartani: btw, what's your internet connection? do you have a flat rate (at home)?
2009-06-02T01:53:34  <amartani> ThomasWaldmann: connection is provided by the university (I live in a dorm)
2009-06-02T01:55:07  <ThomasWaldmann> ok, so you don't need to log out ;)
2009-06-02T01:58:43  <amartani> well, I am reading the logs for when I'm not online, but I can stay online if it's better..
2009-06-02T02:00:30  <ThomasWaldmann> that would be better, logs is one way
2009-06-02T02:22:01  <ThomasWaldmann> gn
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2009-06-02T04:00:08  <CIA-19> Alexandre Martani <amartani AT gmail DOT com> default * 5885:a28dbf415758 2.0-storage-editor-amartani/MoinMoin/ (3 files in 3 dirs):
2009-06-02T04:00:08  <CIA-19> Real-time editor: - Tests for mobwrite action
2009-06-02T04:00:08  <CIA-19> - Adapt mobwrite proxy to rewrite pagename on request
2009-06-02T04:00:15  <CIA-19> Alexandre Martani <amartani AT gmail DOT com> default * 5888:bafe445951a6 2.0-storage-editor-amartani/ (135 files in 33 dirs): Merge 2.0-storage
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2009-06-02T08:00:24  <ThomasWaldmann> moin
2009-06-02T08:31:28  <dimazest> moin
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2009-06-02T09:28:59  <dreimark> moin
2009-06-02T09:43:54  <CIA-19> Dmitrijs Milajevs <dimazest@gmail.com> default * 4740:6162b0cd1da8 1.9-groups-dmilajevs/MoinMoin/groups/__init__.py: Groups2009: GroupManager.update_cache and load_cache check if backend has needed method and then execute it.
2009-06-02T09:43:57  <CIA-19> Dmitrijs Milajevs <dimazest@gmail.com> default * 4741:fa449b9cd5ef 1.9-groups-dmilajevs/docs/CHANGES.dmilajevs: Groups2009: Newline was added in the end of CHANGES.dmilajevs.
2009-06-02T09:50:44  * dreimark has no dsl at home till friday 
2009-06-02T09:50:47  <dreimark> +
2009-06-02T09:51:05  <dimazest> hg q
2009-06-02T09:51:13  * dreimark tries a modem later
2009-06-02T10:15:13  <CIA-19> Dmitrijs Milajevs <dimazest@gmail.com> default * 4757:c45db1dc0a4b 1.9-groups-dmilajevs/ (57 files in 12 dirs): Groups2009: Merge with 1.9
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2009-06-02T11:59:55  <dennda> bloody hosteurope
2009-06-02T12:09:37  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: needing a shell.moinmo.in account?
2009-06-02T12:10:27  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: thanks, but then it won't be "bloody hosteurope" but "bloody hetzner" ;)
2009-06-02T12:10:43  <ThomasWaldmann> :)
2009-06-02T12:11:27  <ThomasWaldmann> waldi and me talked just about the new hetzner root servers
2009-06-02T12:11:58  <dennda> I only got a vps
2009-06-02T12:26:17  <dennda> http://www.golem.de/0906/67480.html
2009-06-02T12:31:09  <ThomasWaldmann> big ms is watching you :P
2009-06-02T12:32:21  <dennda> I'm quite interested
2009-06-02T12:32:45  <dennda> in the technology
2009-06-02T12:32:53  <dennda> i'm a computational visualistics student after all :-)
2009-06-02T12:33:40  <dennda> they've been doing something similar here
2009-06-02T12:33:57  <dennda> cameras on the buildings facing the ground
2009-06-02T12:34:26  <dennda> students running there are then projected onto screens only the audience can see. every student becomes a lemming
2009-06-02T12:34:33  <dennda> in some level
2009-06-02T12:36:46  <ThomasWaldmann> hehe, don't run off the cliff :P
2009-06-02T13:11:22  <TheSheep> 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, oh no!
2009-06-02T13:13:00  <dennda> oh this irony
2009-06-02T13:13:08  <dennda> hosteurope just sent the monthly bill
2009-06-02T13:34:28  * ThomasWaldmann thinks about changing the rootserver moinmo.in runs on
2009-06-02T13:36:51  <ThomasWaldmann> the new product's prices at hetzner are quite similar to what we currently pay, but the servers have about double or triple ressources
2009-06-02T13:40:36  <TheSheep> nice
2009-06-02T13:40:42  <TheSheep> but will it stay that way?
2009-06-02T13:40:50  <TheSheep> add the cost of migration
2009-06-02T13:41:07  <ThomasWaldmann> setup costs 149EUR + my worktime
2009-06-02T13:41:45  <ThomasWaldmann> and I don't think they can change price after you ordered
2009-06-02T13:43:07  <ThomasWaldmann> the only thing less great is that you only get 4 IPs with the servers by default (current offer: 1 base ip + /29 subnet)
2009-06-02T13:43:31  <ThomasWaldmann> more IPs will likely cost >=15 EUR more
2009-06-02T13:44:40  <ThomasWaldmann> considering that we currently only use 3 IPs, we could maybe live with that
2009-06-02T13:46:57  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: isnt n domain names enough?
2009-06-02T13:47:27  <ThomasWaldmann> 4x 2.6GHz cores, 12g ram and 2x1500g disk 69eur/m incl. tax
2009-06-02T13:47:59  <ronny> woah, large
2009-06-02T13:48:09  <ThomasWaldmann> ronny: considering the ressources, having 1 IP per VM (and one for dom0) would be nice
2009-06-02T13:48:40  <ThomasWaldmann> so, 4 IPs -> 3 VMs
2009-06-02T13:48:51  <ThomasWaldmann> that machine could definitely take more
2009-06-02T13:48:52  <ronny> ThomasWaldmann: ah, how many vm's? what about proxying?
2009-06-02T13:50:05  <ThomasWaldmann> yeah, one could proxy or use nat, but that makes the system more complicated
2009-06-02T13:57:16  <ThomasWaldmann> ok, I guess I'll invest my SOC2008 money in this (the cheque isn't cashed yet, but it is nice to finally hold something in the hand)
2009-06-02T13:58:54  <ThomasWaldmann> (there is also an offer for 4x 2.6GHz cores, 8g ram and 2x750g disk 49eur/m incl. tax, but the bigger one seems more attractive to me)
2009-06-02T14:01:13  <ThomasWaldmann> data of current system: 2x 2.8GHz, 4GB ram, 2x400GB disk, 59eur/m
2009-06-02T14:23:24  * ThomasWaldmann has ordered this: http://www.hetzner.de/hosting/produkte_rootserver/eq6
2009-06-02T14:23:47  <dennda> nice
2009-06-02T14:24:22  <dennda> if I ever need to do some number crunching, I know where you are
2009-06-02T14:24:34  * ThomasWaldmann waits for more changesets to fill all that disk space :D
2009-06-02T14:26:03  <ThomasWaldmann> we'll have about 1 month from now for new server testing and 2 months from now to do the switch
2009-06-02T14:28:11  * ThomasWaldmann bets they'll have lots to do this month, switching to one of these new offers is likely to be a no-brainer for most people who have already a server there.
2009-06-02T14:29:47  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: btw there are some tests failing due to stuff you broke (trying to import from attachfile for example, but although others where it isn't as obvious what the cause of the failure is)
2009-06-02T14:30:30  <ThomasWaldmann> sure, AttachFile imports won't work. that stuff will either get fixed or removed.
2009-06-02T14:41:34  <CIA-19> Dmitrijs Milajevs <dimazest@gmail.com> default * 4758:c13bce051efb 1.9-groups-dmilajevs/MoinMoin/groups/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Groups2009: MelitaMihaljevic's wiki_backend is used instead of one based on the GroupDict. Group pages are created in the setup_class in tests.
2009-06-02T14:42:52  <dimazest> dreimark: could you review this commit
2009-06-02T14:43:07  <dreimark> will do
2009-06-02T14:43:16  <dreimark> ThomasWaldmann: nice new server
2009-06-02T14:43:21  <dimazest> 10x
2009-06-02T14:49:55  <dreimark> ThomasWaldmann: dennda how do you proceed with wikiconfig changes in _tests? should we better do a wikiconfig_project instead of altering it?
2009-06-02T14:50:45  <dreimark> similiar to the locl wiki setup, benefit would be that one has to copy it and it is also a snippet example
2009-06-02T14:51:13  <dreimark> s/has/can/
2009-06-02T14:51:40  <dreimark> dimazest: ^^ too
2009-06-02T15:08:34  <dimazest> so, can i define all needed config in wikiconfig_groups
2009-06-02T15:12:17  <dreimark> I would prefer that solution
2009-06-02T15:12:49  <dreimark> btw. do you use your wiki code ?
2009-06-02T15:13:43  <dimazest> how should i use it?
2009-06-02T15:13:51  <dreimark> run a local wiki
2009-06-02T15:14:48  <dimazest> no, i only run tests
2009-06-02T15:15:11  <dreimark> if you add the line you have added to the test config to a wikiconfig_local.py (explained in wikiconfig.py) of the top dir
2009-06-02T15:15:57  <dreimark> then you could run ./wikiserverpy
2009-06-02T15:16:42  <dimazest> ok
2009-06-02T15:17:21  <dimazest> i need to go now, see you!
2009-06-02T15:17:53  <dreimark> ok, have fun
2009-06-02T15:28:38  <dennda> dreimark: don't know what you mean
2009-06-02T15:30:57  <dreimark> dimazest: try such a case #acl UserGroup:read,write,delete,admin All:read
2009-06-02T15:31:07  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: if you got some SOCTODOs I could do now, please add them to the wikipage
2009-06-02T15:31:29  <dennda> dreimark: where are usergroups stored?
2009-06-02T15:31:31  <dreimark> dennda: if the wikiconfig for tests needs to be adapted I think we should do it similiar to the local wikiconfig.
2009-06-02T15:32:18  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: do your tests cover all cases?
2009-06-02T15:32:28  <dennda> certainly not :-)
2009-06-02T15:33:33  <dreimark> dimazest: if a member is given on that UserGroup page he should be able to edit the page
2009-06-02T15:39:51  <dreimark> dimazest: have had a incomplete config. works nice
2009-06-02T15:46:47  <dreimark> dimazest: "MoinMoin - MoinMoin.wikidicts tests" <- no dicts
2009-06-02T15:48:26  <dreimark> s/Test what backend/Test what the backend/
2009-06-02T15:50:15  <dreimark> btw. can you check on your mac if that "# TODO: fix up-to-date check mtime granularity problems"
2009-06-02T15:50:44  <dreimark> is the reason for the failing tess (if they are still failing)
2009-06-02T15:52:07  <dreimark> "* Member - ignore all but first level list items, strip" reads a bit strange for me e.g. s/but/except/ and what do you want to say by ",strip"
2009-06-02T16:01:11  <dreimark> dimazest: expand_groups is missing
2009-06-02T16:04:25  <dreimark> http://paste.pocoo.org/show/120566/
2009-06-02T16:23:54  <dreimark> bbl
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2009-06-02T16:54:45  * ThomasWaldmann sent notifies to the SOC 2008 mentors about $$$
2009-06-02T16:54:56  <xorAxAx> ThomasWaldmann: why is switching a nobrainer?
2009-06-02T16:55:16  <xorAxAx> ThomasWaldmann: in my case, i need to copy an lvm volume blockwise and duplicate the root partition and the raid setup
2009-06-02T16:55:23  <xorAxAx> thats needing a lot of hours
2009-06-02T16:55:26  <xorAxAx> devilsadvocate: ping
2009-06-02T17:00:25  <ThomasWaldmann> xorAxAx: i meant tariff-wise :)
2009-06-02T17:01:14  <xorAxAx> 150 EUR
2009-06-02T17:01:32  <xorAxAx> are to be considered here
2009-06-02T17:02:01  <ThomasWaldmann> we currently have the 59eur/m thing, so even for saving money we could choose the 49eur/m new server offer
2009-06-02T17:02:20  <ThomasWaldmann> the 150eur will pay themselves after 15m and you get a machine 2x more powerful
2009-06-02T17:05:19  <ThomasWaldmann> (i chose the 69eur/m thing though, because getting 3..4times the power for 10eur/m more than now looked even better)
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2009-06-02T19:09:03  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: may I assume the acl parsing part is sufficiently tested?
2009-06-02T19:09:34  <dennda> otherwise i'd need to write tests for any permutation of someuser:<rights>, somegroup:<rights>, all:<rights>
2009-06-02T19:21:18  <CIA-19> Christopher Denter <moin GUESSWHAT the DASH space DASH station ROUNDTHING com> default * 5877:22e27be78231 2.0-storage/MoinMoin/storage/_tests/test_middleware_acl.py: storage: additional testcase for AMW
2009-06-02T20:24:14  <ThomasWaldmann> re
2009-06-02T20:24:44  <ThomasWaldmann> dennda: we already have parser tests
2009-06-02T20:25:49  <ThomasWaldmann> but one thing is likely broken currently: the old on-page ACLs allowed multiple #acl lines. But if you give multiple acl: lines now, it likely will overwrite stuff. But that is rather an UI issue.
2009-06-02T20:26:36  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: I'm just not sure how to structure tests / what tests there should be / what's missing
2009-06-02T20:26:53  <dennda> and yes, that's a UI issue imho
2009-06-02T20:27:10  <dennda> the view should do that
2009-06-02T20:27:35  <ThomasWaldmann> well, you need at least one test per permission type
2009-06-02T20:28:07  <ThomasWaldmann> and for some stuff it might make a difference whether the item is freshly created or already has a page with acl.
2009-06-02T20:28:32  <ThomasWaldmann> and we still need to decide delete :)
2009-06-02T20:28:39  <dennda> to be precise there won't even be multiple lines you need to merge... i hope you don't keep that box but provide a special acl box
2009-06-02T20:29:30  <ThomasWaldmann> maybe I'll keep it, for someone who likes designing UIs :P
2009-06-02T20:31:31  <dennda> permission type == r,w,...?
2009-06-02T20:31:56  <dennda> is there a converter yet btw?
2009-06-02T20:33:17  <dennda> i'll check that later
2009-06-02T20:36:16  <ThomasWaldmann> yes
2009-06-02T20:36:17  <ThomasWaldmann> no
2009-06-02T20:36:34  <ThomasWaldmann> ok
2009-06-02T20:38:39  <dennda> :D
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2009-06-02T20:45:34  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: I guess we need to decide which privileges we want and which not before a converter can be written
2009-06-02T20:55:03  <dennda> ThomasWaldmann: fancy deciding delete now?
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2009-06-02T20:56:11  <ThomasWaldmann> i am a bit undecided about delete, both ways seem to have their pros and cons
2009-06-02T20:57:21  <dennda> maybe we should list them
2009-06-02T20:57:36  <dennda> let's start with trashbin pro:
2009-06-02T20:57:51  <dennda> easy detection of deleted item
2009-06-02T20:59:15  <dennda> more complicated deletion / resurrection (creation of unique ids, etc.; just keeping the items name in the Trash namespace likely ain't work)
2009-06-02T20:59:23  <dennda> err
2009-06-02T20:59:27  <dennda> that's not a pro ;)
2009-06-02T21:01:39  <ThomasWaldmann> no rename to delete item problem
2009-06-02T21:02:16  <ThomasWaldmann> +d
2009-06-02T21:03:30  <dennda> actually that just postpones the problem
2009-06-02T21:04:09  <dennda> you'll have the problem when you try to resurrect an item whose former name is now occupied by a new item
2009-06-02T21:04:41  <ThomasWaldmann> yes, but that is rather obvious then
2009-06-02T21:04:56  <ThomasWaldmann> you usually don't "see" deleted items, though
2009-06-02T21:05:37  <dennda> "see deleted items"?
2009-06-02T21:05:49  <dennda> how would you even undo a delete then?
2009-06-02T21:06:15  <dennda> you'd have to mark the itemname as "was used once, item got deleted, is now in trashbin with name $foo"
2009-06-02T21:06:17  <ThomasWaldmann> if you rename "foo" to "bar" and bar is deleted, it fails, but you do not see "bar" in pagelist
2009-06-02T21:09:39  <ThomasWaldmann> otoh (with trashbin approach), if you delete "bar", recreate bar and then try to undelete the old "bar", it will fail and you will see "ah, ok, it failed because there is already a "bar")
2009-06-02T21:18:31  <dennda> do you agree with what I just said?
2009-06-02T21:19:49  <ThomasWaldmann> in 1.8, you do not see deleted items in TitleIndex or when visiting them
2009-06-02T21:20:05  <ThomasWaldmann> if you look at info action, you'll see that there is something
2009-06-02T21:20:46  <ThomasWaldmann> of course, in a trashbin implementation, there would be a possibility to see the trashbin items with their names and their deletion date
2009-06-02T21:21:41  <ThomasWaldmann> and if you delete with trashbin method, there would be nothing left at old position
2009-06-02T21:22:47  <dennda> oh hab grad meine wahlunterlagen erhalten
2009-06-02T21:22:47  * ThomasWaldmann received order confirmation of EQ6 server
2009-06-02T21:22:51  <dennda> die mach ich mal grad fertig :-)
2009-06-02T21:23:59  <ThomasWaldmann> europawahl?
2009-06-02T21:24:07  <dennda> unter anderem, ja
2009-06-02T21:24:17  <ThomasWaldmann> PP :P
2009-06-02T21:24:27  <dennda> hast du die gewaehlt? :-)
2009-06-02T21:24:41  <ThomasWaldmann> ich hab noch gar ned gewaehlt
2009-06-02T21:24:55  <dennda> is doch die tage deadline afaik
2009-06-02T21:26:08  <ThomasWaldmann> In Deutschland wird traditionsgemäß am Sonntag, also am 7. Juni 2009 gewählt.
2009-06-02T21:26:49  <dennda> wirst du die waehlen?
2009-06-02T21:26:58  <dennda> ich muss jetzt mal flott ueberfliegen was hier alles zur auswahl steht
2009-06-02T21:46:23  <ThomasWaldmann> ja, werde ich
2009-06-02T21:47:24  <ThomasWaldmann> aber sicher nicht unsere aktuell in D regierenden Dilletanten :)
2009-06-02T21:47:49  <dennda> frage mich warum die parteien nicht random auf dem stimmzettel stehen
2009-06-02T21:47:57  <dennda> die grossen amtierenden stehen oben und die die eh keiner waehlt unten
2009-06-02T21:49:04  <ThomasWaldmann> das ist fuer die DAWs
2009-06-02T21:49:50  <ThomasWaldmann> wahlomat ist auch ganz nett, allerdings fehlen einige fragen
2009-06-02T21:58:00  <dennda> omg
2009-06-02T21:58:20  <dennda> mein sandkastenkumpel steht hier bei der wahl zum gemeinderat fuer die cdu auf der liste
2009-06-02T21:59:24  <ThomasWaldmann> tja, frueher haettest ihn noch verhauen koennen fuer sowas :D
2009-06-02T22:00:01  <dennda> ich glaub die brauchten noch ein paar namen
2009-06-02T22:00:04  <ThomasWaldmann> oder ihm sein foermchen wegnehmen
2009-06-02T22:00:24  <dennda> unser dorfbauer bei dem er gern mal den mist geschaufelt hat steht da auch auf der liste bei der cdu
2009-06-02T22:00:29  <dennda> und er is jetzt nicht der hellste...
2009-06-02T22:02:35  <dennda> erstaunlich viele dorfbauern bei der cdu
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2009-06-02T23:59:40  <amartani> moin