2008-01-13T00:27:10 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: so I'd like to talk before i resumbint
2008-01-13T00:27:13 <YoniWiz> *submit
2008-01-13T00:37:02 <ThomasWaldmann> yeah?
2008-01-13T05:35:13 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann:sorry I have not fixed it yet, I am super busy but will finish tomorrow
2008-01-13T10:27:09 <dreimark> moin
2008-01-13T10:51:02 <dreimark> bbl
2008-01-13T14:06:48 <cb22> ah, good to be back in a real operating system
2008-01-13T14:22:20 <stargaming> Win 3.1?
2008-01-13T14:55:15 <cb22> compared to vista, win3.1 is a godsend
2008-01-13T17:21:24 <ThomasWaldmann> moin
2008-01-13T17:22:52 <TheSheep> moin
2008-01-13T17:24:12 <ThomasWaldmann> TheSheep: btw, see that parser changeset from me, maybe you want to do it in a similar way for creole
2008-01-13T17:24:41 <ThomasWaldmann> (it works as is for a|b, but not for a||c
2008-01-13T17:24:49 <ThomasWaldmann> )
2008-01-13T17:24:53 * TheSheep looks
2008-01-13T17:26:12 <TheSheep> ah, you added a second |
2008-01-13T17:26:42 <ThomasWaldmann> yeah, long ago
2008-01-13T17:27:10 <ThomasWaldmann> and the recent change fixed it not to use .+ but [^|]+
2008-01-13T17:28:08 <TheSheep> .+? would allow pipes if there is more than one
2008-01-13T17:28:20 <TheSheep> but it's slow
2008-01-13T17:33:20 <ThomasWaldmann> it didnt work for more than one |
2008-01-13T17:33:42 <ThomasWaldmann> (if the third section is optional)
2008-01-13T17:34:33 <TheSheep> yes, because you would need .+? not .+
2008-01-13T17:34:51 <ThomasWaldmann> i had .+?
2008-01-13T17:34:59 <TheSheep> that's weird
2008-01-13T17:35:10 <ThomasWaldmann> no, it's just ambiguous
2008-01-13T17:36:25 <ThomasWaldmann> btw, we didnt get something going at the creole folks with extending link/transclusion syntax?
2008-01-13T17:42:32 <TheSheep> I guess no interest, plus Creole specs are frozen for now
2008-01-13T17:42:55 <TheSheep> I really don't know what to do with Creole
2008-01-13T17:43:20 <TheSheep> seems like it will be dead in several months
2008-01-13T17:44:37 <ThomasWaldmann> why that?
2008-01-13T17:45:47 <TheSheep> when we reached 1.0, nobody wants to bikeshed anymore :)
2008-01-13T17:46:21 <TheSheep> I guess I need to prepare some nice materials and start advertising among wiki developers
2008-01-13T17:46:41 <TheSheep> and also write a creole formatter for moin
2008-01-13T17:47:39 <TheSheep> on the plus side, I recently got an e-mail with some questions about that standalone creole parson fro python that I separated from the moin plugin
2008-01-13T17:47:50 <TheSheep> so maybe there is some interest after all
2008-01-13T17:48:02 <TheSheep> jus slow
2008-01-13T17:48:06 <TheSheep> just
2008-01-13T17:49:19 <ThomasWaldmann> creole formatter?
2008-01-13T17:49:47 <ThomasWaldmann> for creole export?
2008-01-13T17:49:59 <TheSheep> so that you could use moin plugins to convert *into* creole easily
2008-01-13T17:50:00 <TheSheep> yes
2008-01-13T17:50:12 <TheSheep> maybe even an action to translate a page into creole :)
2008-01-13T17:50:28 <TheSheep> (actually, to translate into any exportable format)
2008-01-13T17:51:03 <TheSheep> I'm also considering that "edit as creole" action
2008-01-13T17:51:52 <TheSheep> but, of course, real life kicks in
2008-01-13T17:57:39 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: can you please explain what I should have listed about creole and parsers?
2008-01-13T18:00:50 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: you can merge the parsers stuff into a single item
2008-01-13T18:01:58 <ThomasWaldmann> see my comments from 11:24
2008-01-13T18:02:42 <YoniWiz> so should one item be "creole and html parser"
2008-01-13T18:02:55 <YoniWiz> and another be about the markup options avalible?
2008-01-13T18:06:40 <ThomasWaldmann> (11:25) < ThomasWal> and moin has some parsers for different markups: Moin Wiki Markup, Creole Wiki Markup, ReST, ...
2008-01-13T18:07:54 <ThomasWaldmann> so for that topic, you need only one item. and you have to find out what moin supports. :)
2008-01-13T18:11:31 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: things like ReSt i would not have known was a parser because I do not really know what this means and so as of now I have gotten rid of HTML parsers and written "parsers for Moin Wiki Markup, Creole Wiki Markup, safe HTML"
2008-01-13T18:12:07 <YoniWiz> *and diffs"
2008-01-13T18:12:34 <ThomasWaldmann> that's not complete, but maybe for that poster it does not need to be complete
2008-01-13T18:13:43 <YoniWiz> so maybe say "Parsers for many things like diffs, safe HTML, Moin Wiki Markup, Creole Wiki Markup, and more"
2008-01-13T18:13:49 <YoniWiz> or and others?
2008-01-13T18:14:08 <YoniWiz> would that be better? and then can I leave the buttlet that says "Many formatting options"
2008-01-13T18:18:11 <TheSheep> "plethorea" ;)
2008-01-13T18:18:42 <YoniWiz> hahah alrighttyyy
2008-01-13T18:21:05 <YoniWiz> plethora isnt it?
2008-01-13T18:21:34 <starshine> yeah
2008-01-13T18:22:01 <ThomasWaldmann> "supports many input formats like Moin Wiki and Creole Wiki markup, safe HTML, syntax highlighting and more"
2008-01-13T18:22:39 <starshine> ThomasWaldmann: do we support old-moin markup or only new moin ?
2008-01-13T18:22:49 <ThomasWaldmann> only new
2008-01-13T18:23:19 <starshine> ok
2008-01-13T18:23:34 <starshine> as long as tables syntax is still easy like old moin my hubby will be happy :)
2008-01-13T18:26:45 <ThomasWaldmann> i didnt change stuff other than links, transclusion, macros
2008-01-13T18:27:16 <ThomasWaldmann> I guess some days we'll have to refactor the lists / nesting stuff, but not now.
2008-01-13T18:33:01 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: xorAxAx: dreimark: the poster (GHOP issue 87) is done and uploaded
2008-01-13T18:35:20 <ThomasWaldmann> did you read the comment from the native speaker?
2008-01-13T18:36:38 <ThomasWaldmann> not ... or SQL, but ... or database
2008-01-13T18:36:56 <ThomasWaldmann> (SQL is a language)
2008-01-13T18:38:30 <ThomasWaldmann> s/input forms/input formats/
2008-01-13T18:38:59 <ThomasWaldmann> Attachments and Themes maybe could get some more words
2008-01-13T18:39:23 <starshine> SQL has native speakers? *duck*
2008-01-13T18:40:30 <ThomasWaldmann> like "Page local file attachments"
2008-01-13T18:40:55 <xorAxAx> starshine: yes, the mother from the xkcd comic
2008-01-13T18:41:14 <ThomasWaldmann> "Plugin themes to customize how Moin looks"
2008-01-13T18:42:33 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: instead of "many formatting options" you could talk about "Support many output formats like ..." (like you did for input)
2008-01-13T18:43:24 <starshine> actually that's much better, because people always comfuse parser and formatter
2008-01-13T18:44:43 <ThomasWaldmann> "discussion subpages with inline comments" well, you CAN do this, but usually those are rather alternatives.
2008-01-13T18:45:45 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: "MoinMoin has many
2008-01-13T18:45:46 <ThomasWaldmann> advantages over other wiki engines. These include the following:"
2008-01-13T18:46:12 <ThomasWaldmann> (like walkerp suggested. sounds better to my non-native ears.)
2008-01-13T18:46:44 * starshine likes Thomas' wording
2008-01-13T18:46:46 <ThomasWaldmann> starshine: http://code.google.com/p/google-highly-open-participation-moinmoin/issues/detail?id=87
2008-01-13T18:53:08 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: I can change it again if you wish but imho that sounded really agressive
2008-01-13T18:53:36 <YoniWiz> and the other things ill change
2008-01-13T18:54:00 <YoniWiz> and what would be the output formats? like subscript and strikethrough etc etc
2008-01-13T18:54:55 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: it is not the aggressive thing i prefer, but "advantage to" sounds strange.
2008-01-13T18:55:26 <ThomasWaldmann> you maybe could also just kill those two sentences
2008-01-13T18:55:37 <ThomasWaldmann> the big headline says enough
2008-01-13T18:58:41 <dreimark> moin
2008-01-13T18:58:56 <ThomasWaldmann> hi dreimark
2008-01-13T19:00:45 * ThomasWaldmann .oO(next time we design a poster we first have a wiki page with the content :)
2008-01-13T19:01:17 <dreimark> I enjoyed the migs, all the backup steps I did seem have not to been necessary :)
2008-01-13T19:01:50 <dreimark> (I should read my sentences my self)
2008-01-13T19:02:02 <dreimark> s/to//
2008-01-13T19:02:29 <ThomasWaldmann> you used a current hg checkout? no exceptions?
2008-01-13T19:04:01 <dreimark> principle yes I have added the past 1.6.0 changes to the 1.6.0
2008-01-13T19:04:26 <dreimark> because of the lang zips in underlay
2008-01-13T19:05:17 <dreimark> I found no problem, may be others do tomorrow
2008-01-13T19:05:55 <dreimark> a minor problem could be length of event-log
2008-01-13T19:08:33 <YoniWiz> btw ThomasWaldmann i am a native english speaker
2008-01-13T19:09:49 <ThomasWaldmann> ah, good :)
2008-01-13T19:13:27 * dreimark comments 99
2008-01-13T19:13:54 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: what are the output formats? just like headings, tables, subscript etc, imbedding images or other mimetypes,
2008-01-13T19:14:32 <ThomasWaldmann> no, output formats are html, plain text, docbook, ...
2008-01-13T19:15:47 <YoniWiz> so should I just list those becasue I do not know where this information is listed? I have read the features page and do not see a section devoted to this... I suppose if I was more code savvy and understood this better I would know but I do not
2008-01-13T19:17:51 <ThomasWaldmann> hmm, wait a sec
2008-01-13T19:18:14 <YoniWiz> okay and how would this be different/better? "discussion subpages with inline comments" well, you CAN do this, but usually those are rather alternatives
2008-01-13T19:19:15 <dreimark> grzywacz: py.test fails for me on ImportError: No module named pyxmpp.presence
2008-01-13T19:21:24 <dreimark> jabberbot/_tests/test_capat.py:4
2008-01-13T19:29:56 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: http://moinmo.in/MoinMoinFeatures
2008-01-13T19:31:16 <YoniWiz> i read that but idk where outfut fortmats are
2008-01-13T19:32:26 <dreimark> YoniWiz: reread please it is changed
2008-01-13T19:32:33 <YoniWiz> k
2008-01-13T19:32:58 <YoniWiz> thanks
2008-01-13T19:59:54 <ernestas> dreimark, moin
2008-01-13T20:00:14 <ernestas> dreimark, could you please review http://moinmo.in/ErnestasLiubarskij/LinuxBrowserPlugins
2008-01-13T20:01:42 <ernestas> sorry for doing the task so late. school, you know...
2008-01-13T20:07:36 <YoniWiz> alright ThomasWaldmann dreimark and xorAxAx any more changes before i sumbit another copy?
2008-01-13T20:08:14 <YoniWiz> oh and also ThomasWaldmann what should I say instead of the discussion subpages thing?
2008-01-13T20:09:19 <YoniWiz> TheSheep: i remember a while ago we discussed marketing strategies and you said ease of use was out or something, what is in again?
2008-01-13T20:10:11 <TheSheep> YoniWiz: out of what?
2008-01-13T20:10:17 <YoniWiz> style
2008-01-13T20:10:31 <YoniWiz> like isnt popular anymore... what is the popular style of marketing is my question
2008-01-13T20:12:18 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: s/with/and/
2008-01-13T20:13:02 <YoniWiz> I changed with to and which is what I think that means but I do not really get it but it comes from old coding command that u type x/(old thing)/(replace old thing with)
2008-01-13T20:13:06 <YoniWiz> is that correct?
2008-01-13T20:15:02 <cb22> xorAxAx: sets a very cool indeed :)
2008-01-13T20:15:05 <cb22> are*
2008-01-13T20:15:20 <xorAxAx> yep :)
2008-01-13T20:17:17 <cb22> now, i just need to figure out how to handle logging
2008-01-13T20:17:56 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: yes, that is what it means
2008-01-13T20:22:07 * YoniWiz submits final copy
2008-01-13T20:27:57 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: you are still talking of "input/output forms", shouldn't that be "formats"?
2008-01-13T20:29:40 <YoniWiz> i thought i had it as many formatting options and you said to change it?!
2008-01-13T20:30:05 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: YoniWiz: instead of "many formatting options" you could talk about "Support many output formats like ..." (like you did for input)+
2008-01-13T20:31:05 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: instead of "many formatting options" you could talk about "Support many output formats like ..." (like you did for input)
2008-01-13T20:32:08 <ThomasWaldmann> how big is the pdf uncompressed?
2008-01-13T20:32:52 <YoniWiz> 36 mb ish
2008-01-13T20:33:25 <ThomasWaldmann> woah
2008-01-13T20:33:27 <YoniWiz> too big to put up without making it a zip but you can make it a pdf yourself by taking the svg file and saving it as a pdf in inkscape or something
2008-01-13T20:33:44 <YoniWiz> yeah idk why its so big but its a A0 so maybe that has something to do with it
2008-01-13T20:34:44 <ThomasWaldmann> now when you do a last change anyway, we could also change that password stuff :)
2008-01-13T20:35:30 <ThomasWaldmann> "Option to require login with password" - well, while this is true of course, we could make it a bit more meaningful
2008-01-13T20:35:59 <YoniWiz> so I must change it again?
2008-01-13T20:36:20 <ThomasWaldmann> you do the form > format change anyway
2008-01-13T20:36:54 <ThomasWaldmann> (one talks about data formats, not data forms)
2008-01-13T20:37:36 <YoniWiz> oh
2008-01-13T20:39:46 <YoniWiz> so how should i make the password thing more interesting
2008-01-13T20:40:11 <YoniWiz> I have 2 tests to study for and hours of homework and I must go very soon so sorry if I seem impatient I am just under pressure
2008-01-13T20:40:50 <ThomasWaldmann> for the auth stuff: "flexible authentication (reusing existing authentication for single-sign-on)"
2008-01-13T20:40:53 <YoniWiz> and it is in svg format so others could add three letters if needed
2008-01-13T20:41:18 <YoniWiz> ThomasWaldmann: i have no idea what that means or where it goes
2008-01-13T20:41:34 <YoniWiz> do I just replace the login bit with what you said?
2008-01-13T20:41:36 <ThomasWaldmann> instead the lower left password stuff
2008-01-13T20:41:43 <YoniWiz> okay
2008-01-13T20:42:50 <YoniWiz> you want me to say "(reusing existing authentication for single-sign-on)" instead of (login accounts with passwords)"
2008-01-13T20:43:14 <ThomasWaldmann> replace the complete item with what i said
2008-01-13T20:43:47 <ThomasWaldmann> (flexibility includes that you don't NEED to use it :)
2008-01-13T20:44:28 <YoniWiz> okay
2008-01-13T20:47:43 <YoniWiz> after those am I truly done?
2008-01-13T20:48:24 <ThomasWaldmann> as far as I am concerned, yes :)
2008-01-13T20:48:44 <xorAxAx> YoniWiz: often it makes sense to get to know the things that you want to advertise :)
2008-01-13T20:48:54 <xorAxAx> before designing the actual advertisement
2008-01-13T20:48:59 <YoniWiz> xorAxAx: yes I agree that is true
2008-01-13T20:49:36 <YoniWiz> xorAxAx: but since I do not have the resources or time to spend learning moinmoin and designing an awesome wiki
2008-01-13T20:49:40 <YoniWiz> i didnt do so
2008-01-13T20:50:18 <YoniWiz> (and that would have taken far longer and ideally I would have done that but I am not familiar with any of the open source projects involved with GHOP, or at least wasnt when it started now I am kinda)
2008-01-13T20:52:15 <xorAxAx> designing a wiki?
2008-01-13T20:52:27 <xorAxAx> i dont think that it would have taken longer :)
2008-01-13T20:53:14 <cb22> hmm, the last claim date for ghop tasks is in 9 days
2008-01-13T20:53:51 <xorAxAx> yes, we should try to avoid blocks if people intend to continue :)
2008-01-13T20:59:40 <ernestas> and we should avoid the school...
2008-01-13T20:59:54 <xorAxAx> avoid the school? :)
2008-01-13T21:00:12 <ernestas> heh, any other variants available?
2008-01-13T21:01:31 <ernestas> well, ok, bye
2008-01-13T21:15:54 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: what has happened to the stars at the left ("bullets")?
2008-01-13T21:18:51 <cb22> xorAxAx: is it possible to do list style '<str>'.join() on sets? i cant seem to
2008-01-13T21:19:30 <xorAxAx> cb22: should work, whats the exception?
2008-01-13T21:20:11 <ThomasWaldmann> YoniWiz: if you have no time left today, you can also do that tomorrow.
2008-01-13T21:20:40 <cb22> xorAxAx: you're right it should. my bad
2008-01-13T21:24:35 <cb22> hmm, what is that number selecting html widget called?
2008-01-13T21:25:54 <cb22> bleh, there isnt one
2008-01-13T21:44:34 * cb22 updates #98
2008-01-13T21:49:20 * ThomasWaldmann looks
2008-01-13T21:50:14 <ThomasWaldmann> cb22: it is nice to leave an empty line between 1. stdlib imports and 2. moin imports
2008-01-13T21:50:41 <ThomasWaldmann> the set magic you are doing is ready availably in python_compatibility module
2008-01-13T21:51:38 <xorAxAx> as i said :)
2008-01-13T21:52:03 <cb22> xorAxAx: ah, so thats its name. i just grepped for 'sets' and found an action that used it like i did
2008-01-13T21:52:49 <ThomasWaldmann> cb22: then you found a missing refactoring
2008-01-13T21:53:06 <ThomasWaldmann> encode problems are still lurking
2008-01-13T21:53:33 <ThomasWaldmann> and that except/pass is not nice to do
2008-01-13T21:54:08 <ThomasWaldmann> you are doing the same os.path.join multiple times
2008-01-13T21:54:52 <cb22> ThomasWaldmann: that .encode is tricky, like i said zips need to have filenames in that cp
2008-01-13T21:55:22 <cb22> and which except/pass?
2008-01-13T21:55:29 <ThomasWaldmann> except: pass
2008-01-13T21:56:07 <ThomasWaldmann> well, some chinese/hebrew/hindi gui will file a bug about that crashing X)
2008-01-13T21:56:15 <cb22> ah right, i see
2008-01-13T21:56:44 <cb22> (the except: pass), should i be a bit more specific, (im trying to ignore dir-already-exists)
2008-01-13T21:57:52 <ThomasWaldmann> it will also crash if someone gives something wrong to recurse param
2008-01-13T21:58:44 <ThomasWaldmann> + attachall = False
2008-01-13T21:58:45 <ThomasWaldmann> + if form.get('attachused', [u''])[0] == "on":
2008-01-13T21:58:45 <ThomasWaldmann> + attachused = True
2008-01-13T21:59:12 <cb22> woops
2008-01-13T21:59:51 <ThomasWaldmann> and except that name confusion, you can do that in one line
2008-01-13T22:02:14 <ThomasWaldmann> + completed = set([])
2008-01-13T22:02:28 <ThomasWaldmann> i think it will make an empty set even without []
2008-01-13T22:04:01 <ThomasWaldmann> sanatized approrpriatly
2008-01-13T22:04:21 <cb22> hm?
2008-01-13T22:08:34 <ThomasWaldmann> + request.url += pagename < non-ascii pagenames?
2008-01-13T22:08:43 <ThomasWaldmann> what's unclear?
2008-01-13T22:09:40 <cb22> ah you meant 'sanatize approrpriatly'? i thought you meant i must sanatize an empty set =)
2008-01-13T22:10:31 <cb22> that was from the original dump.py script
2008-01-13T22:12:14 <ThomasWaldmann> you may fix evil typos
2008-01-13T22:14:55 <ThomasWaldmann> nessacery
2008-01-13T22:15:21 <ThomasWaldmann> afterwords
2008-01-13T22:15:34 <ThomasWaldmann> + for rattr in ["custom_attach", "custom_link_prefix", "custom_link_suffix"
2008-01-13T22:15:37 <ThomasWaldmann> + "custom_link_encode"]:
2008-01-13T22:15:40 <ThomasWaldmann> you still didnt fix that
2008-01-13T22:19:41 <cb22> hmm, i really wish my editor wouldnt crash whenever i did a search
2008-01-13T22:19:57 <cb22> thanks for looking over it ThomasWaldmann, /me gets to fixing
2008-01-13T22:34:46 <grzywacz> dreimark, ack
2008-01-13T22:54:22 <dreimark> ThomasWaldmann: results of 65 is quite more a 82 task
2008-01-13T22:58:44 <ThomasWaldmann> dreimark: yes, i wrote a comment
2008-01-13T23:30:06 <dreimark> ThomasWaldmann: query
2008-01-13T23:39:16 <cb22> dreimark: do you know of a way to see if the current page is a redirect?
2008-01-13T23:50:15 <forrestv_> who is tw-pub...@gmx.de and rb.proj ?
2008-01-13T23:50:44 <xorAxAx> thats ThomasWaldmann and dreimark
2008-01-13T23:51:14 <forrestv_> i updated the icons at http://forre.st/ghop/index.html
2008-01-13T23:54:00 <dreimark> cb22: sorry, no idea currently for what do you need this?
2008-01-13T23:54:06 <dreimark> hi forrestv_
2008-01-13T23:54:41 <forrestv_> dreimark: hi
2008-01-13T23:55:47 <forrestv_> dreimark: what do you think of the revert icon?
2008-01-13T23:56:00 <dreimark> the new one is better
2008-01-13T23:56:23 <TheSheep> I'd rotate it 90° ccw
2008-01-13T23:56:33 <cb22> dreimark: well, for example if i try and dump the page SyntaxReference
2008-01-13T23:56:34 <TheSheep> a la the undo icon
2008-01-13T23:56:50 <cb22> it redirects to MoinHelp or somewhere, but the dump script doesnt follow the direct
2008-01-13T23:56:54 <cb22> redirect*
2008-01-13T23:58:11 <forrestv_> TheSheep: you can compare them again
2008-01-13T23:59:23 <dreimark> cb22: you want to do the redirect to solve this or am I wrong?
2008-01-13T23:59:42 <cb22> yes
2008-01-13T23:59:52 <cb22> if i could get the link that the page redirects to MoinMoin: MoinMoinChat/Logs/moin-dev/2008-01-13 (last edited 2008-01-12 23:30:02 by IrcLogImporter)
